Here we are.

My name is Daniel Garcia and I'm a senior developer at Ortus Solutions.

I am joined by...

Grant Copley.

Hi, everybody.

I'm also a senior developer with Ortus Solutions.

Yes, you are.

And quite a good one at that.

So we want to welcome everyone to the Updated Modernize or Die podcast and thank you for
tuning in.

I want to give a shout out to David Bellinger in the chat.

David is a long time listener.

Good guy.

Miss seeing him at ITB this year.

Hopefully maybe next year he's around.

But yeah, let's get started.

So for Ortus news, the Into The Box 2025 videos are available now for ITB attendees.

Yeah.

So, but wait, there's more.

There is more.

They are now also available for our Patreons.

Nice.

So if you were not able to go to ITB either on site or online, but are a Patreon, you have
access.

I believe they're sending out coupon codes to you.

So if you're a Patreon and you haven't gotten that, please reach out to us and we'll help
make sure you get what you get all access you need.

And those are available to also to any of the attendees that were on site or online,
right?

absolutely.

On site, online and Patreon.

So I believe, David Bellinger gave it, you guys rock.

I assume that's for the, the Patreon making available Patreons.

And so Scott Steinbeck's in the chat another name.

I'm going to have issues pronouncing that also my third screen.

That's like even further away from my table.

I'm just going to say hello everyone.

And so along with the ITB 2025 videos, the Dev Nexus 2025 BoxLang the future is dynamic
recording is now live.

And I believe Grant is going to paste that into the chat.

we got, Scott Steinbeck said, Hey, hey, hey, Michael Rigsby.

Senior, well, he's not senior CB wire because you're senior CB wire.

What would, what would Michael Rigsby be Grant, amigo CB wire?

He is.

He's also, he responds quicker to some of the community support requests that come in than
I do.

So yeah.

And he's also doing some cool things too, which I want to talk about a little bit later if
you haven't already.

So coming up, Ortus Solutions, who's our sponsor, of course it's our sponsor, we're Ortus
Solutions.

But we do offer custom software development.

So if your business is outgrowing your generic tools, Ortus can build you tailored
cloud-ready solutions designed around your processes, goals, and challenges.

With over 19 years experience across the United States, Latin America, and Europe, we help
teams be fast, scale smart, and build modern platforms that truly fit your company's

whether they be web, mobile, API, from scratch, or modernized.

If you are interested, you can book your free 30-minute consultation at sales at
ortussolutions.com.

Mention you're coming from the podcast.

Or you can visit ortussolutions.com slash services slash custom hyphen software.

And we'll get that in there.

And now that we have, done our diligence for the people that pay the bills, let's move on.

Got some BoxLang news.

What's coming up this week, Grant.

All right.

Well, I am told BoxLang 1.3.0 is coming probably by the end of the week, possibly by the
end of the week.

That's the rumor.

I was going to say, yeah, that should be coming up soon here.

I think Luis is going to be at a conference later this week, which we'll touch on.

And I think he wants it available and out before that conference.

And so we don't have the list of all the changes yet.

I haven't seen a release note yet, but I have seen chatter in the internal BoxLang
channels that they are hard at work, finalizing some things, making sure everything is the

way it should be.

then hopefully that'll be out maybe by Thursday, who knows, this week.

Awesome.

And there also, did you see the thing about BoxLang version manager?

It did not.

Let me post a link to it.

And you want to tell us about that?

Yeah, so I just saw this post actually shortly before we hopped on.

So, but from what I understand, this is similar to other version managers from my
understanding.

So maybe like a node version manager where essentially it keeps track of different
versions of BoxLang that you have installed.

So we'll post the link, check that out, make sure I'm not telling you guys wrong, but
yeah, that's super exciting.

I didn't even know we were working on that.

So it makes me wonder what else they've got cooking up in the lab.

It feels like any given day, Luis is like, Hey, this is a really cool thing that I've been
working on and now I'm ready to show you.

It's like, yes, there is.

Yep, yeah, I'm looking at the blog post here.

Powerful new tool that makes managing multiple BoxLang installations effortless across
Mac, Linux, and Windows.

So doesn't matter what operating system you're on.

This is something you could install.

And it looks like it's command line tool.

So yeah, like other version managers.

So if you want to free out the current version, you want to play the bleeding edge version
or an older version, you can kind of toggle pretty easily just the few commands.

Nice.

What would they think of next?

Lots of something cool probably.

Okay.

And then a feature of our show that we've been kind of starting is a BoxLang FAQs.

These are some FAQs that as developers we're thinking you might not know about BoxLang.

Certainly all this information you find on the website boxlang.io or within the docs, but
we just want to kind of call out some interesting things.

Like for example, I know when I first started learning about BoxLang, it took me a minute
or two to grok what this really is.

And that's BoxLang has multiple runtimes.

I'm so used to either Adobe or Lucee where there's only one runtime and that's the
application engine.

And so this whole console vaults runtimes like, what is that?

And why is that cool?

So why is that cool, Grant?

Well, it's cool because, you know, I think what a lot of us are used to is where our
scripts and everything that runs are that we've written, it's all running in sort of this

web context or even, I guess, even more specific kind of like a servlet Java servlet
context.

And with BoxLang, the different runtimes, you know, you can a good example is maybe you
have a script that you want to run just direct like

kind of at the operating system level.

You can do that.

You can run things within a web context, but also there's like Lambda functions you can
build.

And what it really means is that you can run BoxLang in a lot of different environments
and contexts.

And you're not just limited to always having this web context that you have to work with.

So from a practical standpoint, if you only want to build a command line application, only
install the core runtime, you don't need all the extra overhead.

If you only want to do a Lambda, you do the core, well, everyone needs the core, but you
do the core and the Lambda runtime, you don't need any of the other runtimes.

And so you're just by virtue of architecture, your applications are more performant.

You only use what you need, which is fantastic.

And yeah, once I kind of understood that, I'm like, whoa, that is so cool.

I'm sure this is something that other languages do out there and other technologies, but
for me, it was like, wow, this is really, really cool.

And so.

way for sure.

And you don't have all the, you know, the startup of the web context and everything.

You know, I think of things, I mean, we've had this for some time with like CommandBox
task runners where you can, you know, create scripts that run for a super long time.

but, you know, this is something that's even a level above that where it's just, you can
just write a script direct on the, on your command line and run it from the O S and, super

quick.

So it is a bit different, but yeah, it's pretty cool that we've got that now.

Looking at BoxLang, even ColdBox for years, modules and being modular has always been a
core part of our DNA with all our tooling.

And that's just extends into BoxLang.

Everything's modular.

Use what you need.

If you don't need it, don't install it.

I mean, install and play with it.

But if you don't need it, don't install it.

and, yeah, it'll be cool.

And I mean, also opens the door for who knows what's going to come out in the future for
future runtimes.

know there's a lot of them they're working on.

but at any given time.

Luis or Brad has an idea and we got a new runtime and blah, blah.

And it's awesome.

So.

or module for that matter.

anyway, and then the other thing we wanted to bring up is licensing.

We've seen some chatter on the interwebs about BoxLang.

Is it free?

It's not free.

You have to pay for it.

No, BoxLang is free and open source.

It's free as in BoxLang.

And so if you want to get up and running with BoxLang and you have everything you need to
do, you can use it for free.

You don't need to pay Ortus a dime.

If now that all that said, if there are some certain commercial modules that we spent a
lot of time working on and that you need that functionality cause it's not part of the

core things like maybe enhanced Redis integration or enhanced PDF support, then yeah, we
have some modules you could pay for that, but you could do that anyway with currently with

other engines.

So if you're got Lucee and you want to get Redis support, well, get the Ortus Redis
extension.

It's the same thing.

And then of course, if you want official support plans from Ortus, you can pay for those
as well and we'll support you.

If you want to have that, that feel good to know that a company is behind you.

Absolutely.

But if you don't need all that and you're just self-sufficient and you know what, you know
what you know and you can do what you do and it's free.

Yeah.

Yeah, there was some confusion on that.

I think when we initially announced everything, but just to be clear on that.

And I can't promise you this would be the last time I bring that up because I still see
people kind of commenting on it.

you know, why BoxLang?

Why another commercial?

It's just another option.

You got Coke, you got Pepsi, you got Dr.

Pepper.

Three different drinks.

All are sugary goodness.

I'm not sure which one we are, but anyway, so a few other articles that came out talking
about supercharging your BoxLang applications with Maven integration.

Embarrassingly, I don't really know that much about Maven, Grant.

Is that something you can talk about with us?

Well, full disclosure, I don't know a ton of it either, but essentially, it-

more than me, which makes you the expert in this conversation.

But it's a tool that you can run and essentially kind of like you do in your box.json if
you're using CommandBox where you can list dependencies within your project.

You can do that with Maven and kind of automate building and pulling in any dependencies
for your project.

So this is specifically for Java though.

So this would be like Java libraries and things like that.

Might be wrong on that, but we've got a blog post so can find out more about that.

You are OG posted already?

Thought I did, let me double check.

Maybe I didn't.

David Bellinger

Exactly, yeah.

what that means, but, bye.

in that, and I don't exactly know where those libraries are stored, but there's some
repository where things get uploaded, versioned, and then you can pull those down as

dependencies.

So Java inter-op that comes with BoxLang that I have yet to even really get to dig into
much, but with all of that, I'm assuming that's part of it where you can pull in things in

the Java world that you might need.

So basically, I see what David means by that.

So if you wanted to work with something in the Java ecosystem, you just use Maven and
interact and access it just like in the ColdFusion world if you're using Forgebox.

That makes sense.

I'm kind of wondering too, like, I mean, anytime I've needed a, like a jar file to be
included in my app, so I'll have to go out and actually download it.

And sometimes, you sometimes put it in my Git repo, sometimes don't, but there's always
this process of what do you do?

How do we get this jar file into our app?

so this might be a way to even automate stuff like.

Cool.

Well, people smarter than us.

I'd say better looking, just smarter than us can talk about it at length.

But moving on, this next one I can't talk about, streamlining your CI CD, introducing the
setup BoxLang GitHub action.

So we are now making it easier to use BoxLang to integrate into your GitHub actions, your
CI CD actions with your YAMLs to go through and call it.

set it up and do what you want to do.

So if you go to that link, we've got some syntaxes.

can one step installation, get BoxLang up and running and get have actions with just a few
lines of YAML.

Set your versions, very zero configuration.

Set it up, set what you need if you want specific modules with it, whatever, once you get
it.

And again, if you go to that link we sent, we've got some examples of how to set all that
up.

We can check it out.

get your BoxLang up and running, or run your test, build your app, do whatever.

And so that is very, very cool.

And so not something I've played with yet, but I can definitely see myself playing with
this in the not too distant future.

And then finally, we've got the version 171 of the BoxSlang VS Code extension.

I'll be posting the link here.

Okay, I'm just pulling it up.

So if you have not been using the BoxLang VS Code extension, I strongly encourage you to
go check out the BoxLang VS Code extension.

The first thing I'll say is even though it's called the BoxLang VS Code extension, you can
actually use it for any ColdFusion application.

It's got tons of helpers and syntax checkers and other things you can do.

But if you're using BoxLang, then the BoxLang VS Code extension, now with version 171,

has a lot of really cool things.

Um, they've got.

the AI chat participant thing they added?

Yep.

Just ask the questions and it'll get back to you.

that was super cool and it's designed to kind of like higher, better quality answers for
BoxLang and CFML.

So very nice to have that right there.

big feature.

And there's tons of other great features that already exist as well.

I haven't played with the debugger yet.

I know some of our coworkers have and they've talked about how great it is.

And yeah, there's just a lot of cool things.

I mean, this is our comparison.

Other engines have had their builder tools or their quote IDEs.

Well, this is ours and it's built on top of VS Code, which means it's free for everybody.

Free as in BoxLang.

Um, no more free as in beer.

It's going to be free as in BoxLang.

I'm going to see if I can't make that a thing.

yeah.

So that's it for the Ortus News.

Let's move on to the CFML world.

Not that we're not all CFML, but CFML world outside of Ortus and BoxLang So the first
thing that's up is the CFCamp.

Their videos are now online, and if you attended CFCamp, they're free and included.

If you did not attend CFCamp and watched those videos, well, the keynotes are public and
some sessions are public.

But, um, if you want to purchase the entire video package, you can certainly do so.

And there is a way for non-attendees to do that.

That's why I to say it's 119 euros.

Does that sound right?

looking at it before this meeting or before this episode, but, um, you go right online,
the, but yeah, 119 euros.

I don't know what that is in US, but probably not too dissimilar.

But yeah, you get all the videos.

a great conference for a lot of great things about it.

So go check that out.

Also in the CFML news world, there is a new home for the Adobe community.

If you go to adobe.com slash community, you'll see that's the new landing point for all
things Adobe community.

So yeah, we've posted the link there, so be sure to check that out.

And then up next, an update, we've got the SendGrid API email Server settings.

So we'll post a link to this.

If you're using SendGrid, I believe that's similar to like Mailgun or sort of a third
party.

Yeah, like Postmark, Mailgun.

SendGrid owned by Twilio, that's their way to send emails.

And so, yeah, Twilio bought them a couple of years ago.

Twilio used that for SMS and bunch of other cool things.

But, but yeah, so SendGrid, guess when you go into the ColdFusion admin in 2023 and 2025,
SendGrid has this really long 70 character API key that you use.

And when trying to enter it,

It's causing some issues and they thought they had it fixed, but it looks like it's back
again.

And if you go to the link, did you post the link?

Yep.

If you go to that link, Charlie Arehart responded, cause Charlie is awesome.

We love Charlie, responded about what's going on with it and referenced the ticket.

It looks like this might be a new issue that popped back up or an old issue that popped
back up and really only affects you if you're using SendGrid.

But check that out.

up next, there was an important deprecation announcement for Adobe CF.

I'm going to post the link here.

But it looks like it was specific to updates to the com, d.com, Axis1.

And I saw something mentioned about SharePoint as well.

Yeah, haven't used, I don't know if I've ever used com or dcom.

I remember like seeing references to it in the documentation, but you know, an Axis1 is
pretty, pretty old.

Yeah, and I think from what I was saying in this is a forum post, but in the upcoming, the
next bug fixes, I think that are going to be released, they're actually going to remove

those

Yep.

And they do have an email address they list, cf-deprecation.dolby.com.

If you have any questions on what's being removed and why, like the rich text editor
support, that's going away it looks like.

That one I did use at one point, once upon a time, but...

So yeah, definitely check these things out.

And then we have Ben Nadel, our buddy Ben.

This is a blog post, destructuring complex queries in the ColdFusion objects.

Do you want to talk about that one, Grant?

Yeah.

So from what I was reading, he was looking at a way to take kind of nested query data and
basically destructuring that into structs and arrays inside of a cold fusion.

And he talks too about how there's some, you know, there is some built-in ways to do this
and kind of modern databases, but he was looking for a way to do it in CFML.

And so, yeah, he kind of.

blogs his journey with that.

Yeah, you mentioned the, JSON I know at Into The Box.

Bill Reese did a session where he talked about using some of the JSON tooling in a
Microsoft SQL server.

And so if you're an attendee and didn't catch a session or you're a Patreon and want to
learn more, you can go to see upcast and go check it out.

shameless plug for, for Bill Reese and Into The Box videos.

Okay.

So moving on events, several events are coming up that we want to talk about.

Ooh, we're starting to run out of time too.

Let's keep going here.

Um, so as mentioned already, Into The Box video series is now live on CFCasts.

You can go to it.

Uh, again, uh, if you're there or online, you get it free.

Patreon's getting free.

Um, the series is also available for purchase for just $250.

It's on demand.

lifetime access, that's two days of content.

And then regular CFCasts subscribers should get access to it on November 1st.

But if you are not a Patreon, didn't go, and you can't wait that long, 250, you know, it's
not that much.

Just like CFCamp sells their video packages to non-attendees we do it too.

Anyway, also the ITB slides are out.

You can check out our latest ITB blog post, the 2025 replay, day one and day two.

which is also now at CFCasts.

I believe that one is probably free if they're the keynotes.

Tomorrow, Luis is going to be presenting building AWS Lambda apps with BoxLang.

And if I had to guess, I bet he's going to be using the Lambda runtime to build his Lambda
app.

That's gonna be cool.

I mean, you can go ahead and register.

It's a free event.

We want you register.

You can see at the link and Granted, go ahead and set that up.

It's at a Wednesday, June 18th at 11 AM Chicago time, CDT, Chicago D time.

Can't remember what CDT stands for.

Daylight time.

after that we've got, what's that?

man.

After that, we've got a July webinar, Raymond Camden.

Let's build an app with BoxLang is going to be July 23rd at 11 a.m.

CDT and free tickets will also be available on Wednesday after our June webinar.

So all these great content coming up.

There is the America Digital Mexico June 17th at 2025 today in Mexico City.

Ortus has been invited to showcase BoxLang.

Groundbreaking new programming language at the 9th America Digital Mexico Conference.

It's a major event.

And if you are there and happen to be there, join us at booth C36 or C36.

I think I said that right.

And I'm coming up into this week.

have Open South Code 2025 in Spain on June 20th through 2021.

It's at La Teremica in Malaga.

Ortus again is a gold sponsor and we'll get the link for that.

If you're in Europe and you want to take like a weekend trip to Spain, why not?

Go check out the beautiful countryside and go see Ortus and Luis.

Yeah, I want to do that.

call Mike Rigsby to the rescue central daylight time.

I know, man.

That might just have to be Chicagoland Daniel time.

Keeping with the theme.

After that, the CF Camp slides recordings are up on our Ortus site YouTube channels and go
ahead and get that.

Or like we mentioned before, you can also go to CF Camp and get everything for a low, low
price of 119 euros.

I just saw this today, Grant.

The Adobe ColdFusion Developer Week 2025, June 23rd to 27th.

It's an online thing.

And I think I've just been, I've been a little bit busy the last week and a half, as you
know, Grant, I came down to Nashville with my son and wife and saw you and your lovely

family and got to hang out.

Grant took us to this really, really good Southern food restaurant.

It was awesome.

The Loveless Cafe.

And we come down there again sometime.

I kind of want to go back.

It was great seeing you guys and you got to jam with my son.

I did.

We might have to post those videos.

We did a few cover songs.

Yeah, that was really good.

But, anyway, I can go on at length, like about how awesome it is you and your family are
and hanging out with you, but the show must go on.

following all of this in, we have the Adobe ColdFusion Summit 2025, September 22nd and
23rd, certification available the 21st to 24th.

I, we have the link for the speakers, but I think the speakers are all full and they're
actually announcing speakers.

And what's one exciting thing?

that we could announce, Grant?

Can we announce it?

Well, how about this?

Are you going to be there?

I am gonna be there, I will say that much.

Yep.

Yeah.

We had a funny little thing on last Friday.

We're hanging out and we're talking about CF Summit.

And I'm like, all right, Grant.

It's awesome.

You're to be presenting.

And for some weird reason, you're like, thought it was like in a few weeks.

So we're starting to like panic.

I get my presentation ready.

Like, no.

first CF Summit and super excited to go and yeah I will be presenting so looking forward
to it.

on off-rides.

got like two months before you have to like panic.

So plenty of time, plenty of time.

And, I,

on the, on the panicking.

Yep.

And I think so far I heard, I thought that Luis is presenting, I believe, and Jacob Beers
from Ortus is also presenting.

And so, so far three, they're still announcing different speakers.

So who knows?

There might be more of us.

That might mean none of us.

Who knows?

But watch out for that.

But we know Grant is going to be there.

And if you needed any reason to go, that should be reason enough.

Mike Mike Rigsby says topic.

I'm not sure I can say so we'll just play it safe.

Probably, I think we're comfortable saying it's probably ColdFusion related.

Probably.

Yep.

Yep.

No, you know.

I was trying to think of another language.

completely blanked the Laravel here.

Anyway.

a framework Daniel.

man uh

man.

And finally, Into The Box, 2026 is coming soon with blind ticket pricing.

Stay tuned.

I believe it's going to be, do we, I know if we have the exact date yet.

I believe it is going to once again be in Washington DC.

yeah, we don't have the details just yet, but once we start getting them, we will start
posting them probably end of April, early May.

would be my guess for the dates.

once we know more, you'll know more.

And you'll see it all over our blogs and socials and everything else.

Okay.

And with all of that, we want to say a big thank you to everyone that's here in the chat
hanging out with us.

We want to say a big thank you to all our Patreon supporters, especially because these
individuals are personally supporting our open source initiatives.

for all the great tools like CommandBox, ForgeBox, ColdBox, ContentBox, TestBox, BoxLang,
and everything else.

Your contributions fund the cloud infrastructure our community relies on for things like
ForgeBox, Package Management with CommandBox.

And if you want to support us, what can they do, Grant?

you can go to this link that I just posted.

So it's our Patreon page and you can check out our different memberships that we've got.

And Daniel, you probably know more about those than I do.

So I'll let you talk on that.

pay for the year, you save 10%, which is, you know, a deal at any price.

But if you're a bronze package and up, you now get a Forgebox Pro and CFCasts subscription
as a perk for your Patreon subscription.

All Patreon supporters have a profile badge on the community website, as well as their own
private forum access on the community website.

And finally, you have your own private channel on the BoxTeam Slack.

And as we learned just a little bit earlier this episode,

All Patreon supporters get access to the Into The Box videos.

So if you are a Patreon supporter and you do not have access yet, reach out, let us know.

Reach out to us in Slack, in the Private Slack channel.

We'll get you, we'll hook you up, we'll take care of it.

And if you want to go ahead and post the community link, I want to say we're up to about
61 Patreons now.

So many that we kind of stopped listing them out.

And this we're reading them out in the podcast because we're trying to keep this down to
like half an hour.

So you can see the list of all our sponsors though on the Ortus website ortussolutions.com
slash about hyphen us slash sponsors.

Cool.

Anyway, just want to say thanks Grant.

It's always awesome hanging out and seeing you, especially after I just saw you.

It's still awesome seeing you online.

Likewise, and thanks sir everybody that joined us today.

It's always great having you guys.

Yep.

And we'll see you all.

don't forget those webinars tomorrow.

And hopefully, we'll see you on the...

we're doing the podcast the first and third Tuesday of the month.

And so, the next one, I believe, will be in July.

So take care everybody.

Thanks.

Bye everyone.